Your Radian gains?

Discussion in 'Radian' started by Brad Meier, Sep 19, 2012.

  1. Joe Azzarelli

    Joe Azzarelli Active Member

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    Josh
    I believe the 'mod' is helpful (higher gains) without adverse effect. I am not excited about the roll stabilization yet, so more work to do..



    Joe
     
  2. Josh Lambeth

    Josh Lambeth Well-Known Member

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    Def looks better!

    Josh
     
  3. Philipp Goose

    Philipp Goose Member

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    Here is the video with 10mm spacer. The Gimbal is now free to move but hase a to big movement in pan axis
     
  4. Brad Meier

    Brad Meier Active Member
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    They are all model airplane trim sheets. Local hobby stores usually carry it.
     
  5. Brad Meier

    Brad Meier Active Member
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    Joe,

    What kind of camera is that and what are your gain settings? I'm now getting fairly stable video without the radians using 9mm O rings and a peice of silicon tubing running through the the rings. Turned the radians on and it gets worse.. Like my first video. By looking at my vid would you say the gains are too high?

    Josh, your gimbal looks to move about like mine now. Not much play at all. Did you have a camera mounted when you did the video? I couldn't tell. What kind was it?
     
  6. Brad Meier

    Brad Meier Active Member
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    This is using 9mm O rings with silicon tubing running through the rings. It has a little play but not a lot. Plan on testing Radian settings tomorrow if it finally stops raining.

     
  7. Andy Johnson-Laird

    Andy Johnson-Laird Administrator
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    Brad: It's hard to tell without seeing the Canon video, but were you getting some jerky motion when the gimbal stopped panning?
    What do you have the pan gain set to please?

    Thanks
    Andy.
     
  8. Brad Meier

    Brad Meier Active Member
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    The canon video still had a lot of roll and tilt motion probably due to gains set too high. They are up around 120. I haven't had a problem with pan/yaw at all and that was set at 65 I believe. I'll post all my settings once I get it stable.. Then I'll move on to the Sony cx760.
     
  9. Andy Johnson-Laird

    Andy Johnson-Laird Administrator
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    Thanks, Brad. Was that a 5D Mk II or III? It didn't look like you'd had to use the 200 mm side booms that I had to use to get the Mk III to balance.

    I've got to move on to the CX760 too -- I've got the camera platform elevated about 6mm from it's normal position for the Mk III just to get the CoG onto the roll axis. It'll be interesting to see what I have to do to balance the CX760.

    Andy.
     
  10. Brad Meier

    Brad Meier Active Member
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    Its a 7D with 16-35L.

    Why not bring the forward part of the gimbal up to raise the CG instead of adding spacers under the mount? My side booms are higher in the front than back to bring the CG up to meet the rotation axis. Or maybe this will limit your roll with the 5d.3. Ive already got all the parts to do it with the CX760 in waiting..

    Ive also thought about putting a longer vertical tube in to get the camera further from the copter to avoid booms getting in shots. But that may cause more vibration issues.
     
  11. Andy Johnson-Laird

    Andy Johnson-Laird Administrator
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    Thanks re: camera.

    I was mis-remembering: the problem I needed to solve (which I described in more detail on this thread a couple of weeks ago) was to to lower the camera plate to bring the CoG in line with the tilt axis -- and that you cannot do with the side arms' angle. So I ended up using the Epic tilt bars, however they allow you to lower in units of 8mm, and I only needed -4mm. So that's why I needed to shim the camera plate up. The Epic tilt bars (being longer) would have fouled on the rear transverse boom, so that meant I had to change to the 200 mm side booms to move the front transverse boom forward far enough to prevent that fouling. (Can you see why I was misremembering this? :) ).

    That's the long explanation for the short answer: You're right. The side booms being higher at the front is the way to elevate the CoG in line with the roll axis to balance it in roll.

    As you say, a longer vertical post might make it easier to avoid the boom-in-shot problem.....but, firstly, I wonder by how much you'd have to lengthen it to really fix the problem and, secondly, yes, you're right, that may cause more vibration issues.

    Andy.
     
  12. Brad Meier

    Brad Meier Active Member
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    Ok.. live from my test site. I started today testing gains and also vibration isolation modifications. So far I have GoPro footage of stock 10mm O-rings, 10mm with silicon tubing inside the rings, 9mm O-rings, and 9mm with silicon tubing. From my laptop.. didnt appear to be much different but ill upload some vid tonight.

    In the world of gains, I started up around 90 with tilt and 115 with roll. I have decreased by 5 all day and flown about the same pattern. Temp is 74F with no wind. I just flew at 30 tilt and 80 roll and im starting to get smoother movements but still not there. Roll has been pretty good but tilt has been giving me issues. Im probably at around 20 flights right now and still decreasing gains. Its very frustrating because my tilt gains are so low now that it appears it cant keep up with the copter.

    Ill post some stuff tonight.. but can some of you guys post a quick clip of your vid and what your gains are set at? I would think similar setups should have numbers within 50% of each other..
     
  13. Marc BRACELET

    Marc BRACELET Active Member

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    I fly now with Sony CX730 my gains, with a perfectly balanced gimbal are, Roll and Pitch at 130, Yaw at 60 and all seems to be OK, no problem with jittering or another bad vibrations...( i think my gains are to high but Radians are fine with this settings, so, what else...):cool:
    Oh, important thing, i run my servos at 5,2 Volt...

    EDIT : Far better now with Roll 90, Tilt 110 and yaw 60, i think it's now OK for my settings and i'll will post a video soon...:)
     
  14. Brad Meier

    Brad Meier Active Member
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    Thanks!

    Yeah I gave up on the 7D with 16-35 Lens for now. I got tilt gains down to 20 and knew it wasnt going to get better. Ill take a look at the footage tonight and see if I missed the sweet spot. Looks to me that my mount is what causes all the issues. May just only be able to use IS lenses? Anyone out there not using Canon IS glass and getting good results?

    So I have a CX760 but never used it on the copter.. til now. With the radian gains where I left off on the canon experiment and not balancing the camera in roll I got smooth as butter results. Even at 35-40 mph.. Lots of boom of course.. But Super Smooth! Im amazed!
     
  15. Tabb Firchau

    Tabb Firchau Administrator
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    HI Brad, 20 is way too low on the gain, that is for sure. I shot quite a bit with Canon 16-35 during the testing phases of the Radian....let me try and find some footage.

    Yeah the CX760 is just incredible! Like buying a cineflex for 1200 bucks!
     
  16. Brad Meier

    Brad Meier Active Member
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    Im getting too much vibration for the Radians to be able to stabilize the 7D and 16-35. I noticed there is some play vertically in the 360 main shaft. It seems to be about 1mm of play but I dont see how that could be causing all my issues. With the weight of the camera + gimbal theres no way that could be floating vertically in flight. Maybe props? MK settings? No wind and a slightly ascending hover should be the most stable situation and Im still not getting usable footage there. Tabb: I'd be interested to see some of that footage...

    In other news... Here are some GoPro vids testing isolator mods. 9mm and original 10mm O-rings with and without silicon tubing inside. Enjoy

    Stock 10mm O-rings


    10mm O-rings with silicon tubing


    9mm O-Rings


    9mm O-rings with silicon tubing
     
  17. Tabb Firchau

    Tabb Firchau Administrator
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    Hi Brad, would love to see footage from the camera on these if you have it! That would be helpful.
     
  18. Andy Johnson-Laird

    Andy Johnson-Laird Administrator
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    Yeah. I was thinking I had joined the League of Guys Who Stare At Video Clips.....
    I was having a hard time seeing much difference between the different clips -- pretty subtle....

    The Canon footage might be more telling as to what's going on.

    Andy.
     
  19. Brad Meier

    Brad Meier Active Member
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    Balanced a new set of props today... going to try that next. Slowly eliminating any possiblilities.

    Tabb: sent you a link to the video
     
  20. Tabb Firchau

    Tabb Firchau Administrator
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    Brad, Can you check how sloppy your tilt servo is? I noticed quite a bit more tilt jitter then I am used to seeing.

    Thanks!
     

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