Wireless video alternatives to Teradek/Paralinx?

Discussion in 'MōVI M10' started by Matt Pope, Apr 2, 2014.

  1. Matt Pope

    Matt Pope New Member

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    We just got off a pretty complicated Movi shoot and the Movi was fantastic. Our Teradek Bolt Pro, on the other hand, left plenty to be desired. The majority of our delays were related to trying to sync/resync our video signal between the transmitter and two mobile receivers. Distances were never longer than 30-40 feet and typically shorter than that, we were outside, antenna's as clear as possible, etc.

    We're still within the return period and are seriously considering returning them if we can find a stronger alternative. I haven't tried the Paralinx for a few reasons. One, if it has the same chip as the Teradek (which I read somewhere), I'm skeptical that it would make much of a difference. Two, we already use the Teradek Cube to automatically create h.264 proxies as we're shooting. That requires a start/stop signal to be passed through via HDSDI, so anything that strips that signal out by going to HDMI wouldn't work well for us.

    Our budget is certainly not unlimited, but I'd love to know what alternatives there may be for us to check out, even if the price is higher. Does the Bolt Pro 2000 work that much better? Anything supposed to be coming down the line at NAB that's worth keeping an eye on? I know I can google wireless video solutions, but figure this forum might know which options are likely to work best with the particular needs and requirements of Movi operation.

    Thanks!
     
  2. Sam Donaghy Bell

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    I have to say our bolt pro 2K is pretty fantastic. It wont go through walls but it's line of site is great.
     
  3. Matt Pope

    Matt Pope New Member

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    Sam, when you say it won't go through walls, just how picky is it? With the non-2k version, if we had an actor's body, or a car windshield, or basically anything more than a stiff breeze come between the two we would lose it, and reconnecting never happened quickly.
     
  4. Sam Donaghy Bell

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    I've never honestly taken a good look at when things get in it's way but I've never noticed anything like that and we shot in a house with a lot of people coming and going. It was pixelate a little (it does this when it's struggling) but picture doesn't drop out.
     
  5. Martin RIley

    Martin RIley New Member

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    We're running the Paralinx Arrow + and I do have to say it's been flawless - even through walls.
    We run it with a crossbow when we need HDSDI, and regularly run it with 2 TX units along side 2 or 3 RX units.
    Our personal experience has been a good one...
     
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  6. Wolf Schiebel

    Wolf Schiebel Active Member

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    The Paralinx contains the same chipset but a better firmware and due to pure Hdmi is even more lag-free, since no internal converter.

    No issues so far and reconnects in about 10-15 sec.


    Best, Wolf
     
  7. Matt Pope

    Matt Pope New Member

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    Wolf, I'm not sure what you mean by pure HDMI, but that's what has me worried because of our need to pass along the start/stop signal for the Teradek Cube. It's my understanding from Teradek that HDMI spec doesn't include a start/stop flag, so that on the Bolt at least, in order to pass along that flag for the Cube to use, the Bolt must be HDSDI and not HDMI.

    Does anyone know whether we would be able to pass along a start/stop flag via the Paralinx if we were to use the Crossbow HDSDI option? If not, the Paralinx really won't work for us. As it is, I'd really rather not use HDMI since everything else in our workflow on set is HDSDI. But if it'll solve our wireless video issues and not cause a problem with the Cube, it might be worth giving it a shot.

    I know I've seen Paralinx reps post on here before - can anyone speak to the start/stop flag issue?
     
  8. Michael Gailing

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    Hi Matt,

    Im sorry to hear about your experience with the Bolt.

    First, me dispel some rumors.

    Paralinx does not have "better" firmware. It is stock firmware and there is no real way to quantify whether the firmware is the issue or something else. Pure HDMI sounds nice, but it doesn't actually mean anything. Our internal converters do not add any sort of latency. We've had these units out for quite a while now and despite numerous tests, nobody has every demonstrated latency being added via our SDI units.

    You are correct that only our SDI Bolt Pro units pass metadata, the HDMI cannot. We are the only device on the market using this chipset that can do such a thing. Paralinx, IDX, etc... cannot.

    Now, onto the wireless link issues. How did you have your Bolt TX and RX mounted? If you have the RX mounted against the MoVI controller, then that is likely your problem. Even though the controller operates on 2.4GHz, it can still occasionally cause interference with 5GHz devices. You must also make sure that the antenna caps are free of any objects. Would you mind sending me a picture of how your rig was set up?

    If you have any further questions, I'm happy to help. Shoot me an email and feel free to copy Support:
    Mike @ Teradek . com
    Support @ Teradek . com
     
  9. Wolf Schiebel

    Wolf Schiebel Active Member

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    Mike,

    i certainly don´t want to bash your product. I tested both units really thorougly, and my first decision was the Teradek Bolt because of HD-SDI, since that is the standard in the professional industry. But: It´s a fact that in all our tests the Paralinx had a better range and most important: The reconnection of the Bolt unit took always (!) 3-10 minutes if loosing connection due to range or walls, and the main reason for choosing the Arrow+ was the real much faster way of handling this (5-20 sec, as mentioned). I don´t want to exclude that i did some mistakes, but since i work with video-links (analog and digital, GMS, Microlite etc..) for 6 years now, i think i have an idea of what i´m doing. But you are right that the "better firmware" comment was just my assumption and shouldn´t have been posted as a fact here.

    Again, i don´t want to rule anything, that are just personal experiences, and i´m open to discussions, and hope Matt finds a solution for his problem.


    Best,

    Wolf
     
  10. Trevor Rogers

    Trevor Rogers Member

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    I have a Teradek Bolt just regular. I bought it just before they came out with the 2000 foot one :( It works through walls fine as long as I stay with the camera. Check out 1:59 on this video. The actor goes upstairs while I got down stairs. I kept connection through 2 stories. I just had to stay with him. If I ran down stairs and out side before the camera came outside I would usually loose connection. However I wouldn't take 3 to 10 min to reconnect. Maybe 10 sec which feels like forever when you loose connection. But in this video I never lost connection. I was never really close to the camera. Like when the video first started I was controlling the camera from the door of the house while it was in the car.

    Sounds like you had it mounted weird. Or make sure you don't use the internal power with the teradek. Power it with the reversed lemo. That is the only way you can get the 300' range. If you use the internal power it seems to go down to 20'. Plus it only lasts an hour or so. I costom built my own reversed Lemo cables one to power of P-Tap and another to power off a 2 Pin Lemo So i can use my power block. Anyways Here is the link to the video:

     
  11. Michael Gailing

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    Hi Wolf,

    No hard feelings! I know you're not out to bash the products.

    Your experience with the Bolt is pretty unique since I have not heard of 3-10 minute reconnection times ever. The unit may have been damaged or you were in an environment that had a ton of 5GHz traffic. Adding SDI components, a new chassis, metadata pass-thru, and other features like we did won't affect the transmission range or resiliency. We performed range tests on 100% of our units before they ship so it would be impossible to let units go out that perform like this.

    We did have some issues with our very first units that came out at the end of 2012 and beginning of 2013. Those were all upgraded for free and should no longer have problems. If you still have your unit, I would be happy to pay for it to be shipped back here so we can take a look at it.

    If you're going to NAB, stop by and say hello (Booth: C8218). I'd be happy to show you all of the latest and greatest we have coming for this line of products!

    Mike
     
  12. Matt Pope

    Matt Pope New Member

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    I'm traveling today and can't send pics of our setups, but I'll try to do so soon. We were using one receiving on a rig that included the Movi transmitter and we were using the other receiver at times on portable director's monitor rig and at times mounted in or to a vehicle that was always within 30-40' of the transmitter.

    I will agree with Wolf that when we lost connection, it often took a while to get it back. Not 10 minutes, but long enough that we often just powered off/back on the transmitter after a minute or two because it just kept searching. The other issue was that we often lost signal when switching from record mode to playback mode on our Epic Dragon. And there were quite a few times that we had a connection but it was saying to check for video signal when we knew the camera was feeding one. To be honest the only solution that we ever seemed to have for that issue was turning off the tx and then turning it back on.

    We weren't ever using internal power for the tx. We had it powered off a p-tap cable. The receivers were either powered off the AC adapters or off a modded SmallHD LP-E6 battery plate.
     

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