Toad in the hole dimensions/mount pattern

Discussion in 'Camera Mount Misc' started by Mark Harris, Sep 29, 2014.

  1. Mark Harris

    Mark Harris Member

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    Hi All,

    I'm working on a copter design and its been requested that I use the Toad in the Hole for a quick release. I can't find any drawings or dimensions other than the very vague "53x56x40" is about useless as it gets.

    I cannot find any documentation at all on this product, is there a manual with a technical drawing somewhere? For $300 I'd expect an engineering drawing to be available at the very least.. or a AP214 STEP or solidworks model? Even just a hole pattern??

    Have I missed something here?
     
  2. Andy Johnson-Laird

    Andy Johnson-Laird Administrator
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    That's a question for FF themselves, Mark. Try an email to support@freeflysystems.com -- although I presume if you've been asked to use one, the other option would be to purchase one? Or, as you say, "have I missed something here?" :)

    Andy.
     
  3. Mark Harris

    Mark Harris Member

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    I thought I was asking FF themselves by posting here :) I'll send an email as well.

    The option would be to buy one, but the project timeline is pretty tight and being in Australia having to order one to get basic measurements would delay the project quite a bit more than just having a technical drawing available :)
     
  4. Andy Johnson-Laird

    Andy Johnson-Laird Administrator
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    G'day Mark:
    The forum is run by FF, and certainly FF support folks do frequent the forum. Gary and I, the forum moderators are volunteers. Your fastest bet, therefore is sending an email.

    Andy.
     
  5. Mark Harris

    Mark Harris Member

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    Thanks, I have emailed them hopefully I hear back soon :)
     
  6. Mark Harris

    Mark Harris Member

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    I received a response from Freefly support. They will not supply any dimensions (even a mount pattern) as that is all proprietary. They are 100% OK with reverse engineering however, and suggest I reverse engineer their product, or ask someone else to.
     
  7. Gary Haynes

    Gary Haynes Administrator
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    Mark background on the answer is likely based on the history that the original Cinestar products were cloned by the Chinese. Also the original MoVI, well they tried to copy that one but got it wrong since they engineered a version based on the pre-production models. Somewhat comical. Theft of intellectual property is rampant. Same problem you may experience when the Chinese duplicate one of your products and sell it for pennies on the dollar. Why would Dragonlink supply someone else with the circuit diagrams and BOM?

    That said the layout of the attach points are on 32mm centers, and are a square. It is the same layout used from the beginning for the Cinestar gimbal mounting star.
     
  8. Mark Harris

    Mark Harris Member

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    I have had products cloned before, it doesn't bother me. For DragonLink, the circuit can likely be reverse engineered in an hour or two... its really nothing complicated for an RF engineer. The circuit is less than half the equation, its what is running on the microcontroller that makes the product. If I make a mechanical fixing, I want people to be able to use it in their products.

    Check the service manual of pretty much any electronic device you have, from a cordless drill charger to a cinema projector - it has the full schematic for the product in there.

    I've never had anyone tell me that their dimensions are proprietary before. I deal with dozens of suppliers and manufacturers daily. It makes me extremely reluctant to use it just to satisfy a client who only want to use it because it doesn't require any custom machining. Its less work to build my own quick release based on a rail system than to buy, wait for delivery and reverse engineer theirs. This is unfortunate as it does look like a nice product, and it turns what should have been 10 minutes work into an hour or more.

    If I email Slik or Manfrotto for example, asking for a technical drawing of one of their ball heads I will have it in a day or two.

    Thank you very much for the mounting pattern, I couldn't even find that much, I think this is going to go in the "not worth my time" basket unfortunately.
     
  9. DJ Vegh

    DJ Vegh New Member

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    I too ran into the same issue today as Mark.

    We developed a self powered cable cam system (FlyLine) and have been getting numerous requests from our customers for a mounting plate that will fit to the Toad in the Hole so that they may use the MoVi on our cablecams.

    Figured I'd drop FreeFly and email and ask them for the four hole pattern dimensions since I did not see them listed on the website.

    I got an an immediate 'go pound sand' answer. Claimed that information is proprietary and not subject to release.

    I find it rather odd and confusing that they will not release that information since the Toad in the Hole product's PRIMARY PURPOSE is to allow the MoVi to be mounted to a multitude of third party products.

    *edit - a resolution is in the works.
     
  10. Tabb Firchau

    Tabb Firchau Administrator
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    We will get this info sorted soon. Sorry for the inconvenience, I am sure I probably gave customer support team some bad info and caused this issue.

    Give us another chance DJ.....we go waaaaaay back ;)

    Tabb
     
  11. DJ Vegh

    DJ Vegh New Member

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    Thanks for the quick reply Tabb. I was hesitant to name drop you to the customer rep because I didn't want to come off as an ass, but I'm glad we can get it worked out. We've been getting quite a bit of response in recent weeks asking if our FlyLine can support the MoVi and I want to be able to give a definitive answer as well as supply an adapter plate.
     
  12. Tabb Firchau

    Tabb Firchau Administrator
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  13. DJ Vegh

    DJ Vegh New Member

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    We finished up out mounting plates for our FlyLine cablecam. They are now compatible with TITH mount. Flying a MoVi on the FlyLine is as easy as clipping on to the Toad.
     

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