The upgrade process for those outside of America?

Discussion in 'MōVI M15' started by Angus Benson-Blair, May 3, 2014.

  1. Angus Benson-Blair

    Angus Benson-Blair Active Member

    Joined:
    Jan 23, 2013
    Messages:
    148
    Likes Received:
    25
    I was just wondering what the process will be for those outside of the good ol' US of A. Clearly the process at the moment will involve sending the M10 back to Freefly for the upgrade to be made. But, from good ol' little Blighty does that mean I am having to ship this over at further expense, deal with customs charges when it gets returned and what about down time as this process will mean being without a Movi for a considerable time during prime filming season??????

    Perhaps a better way to handle this would be to send out the M15 first, giving the customer a specific window of lets say 7 day on receipt of the M15 in which to ship back the M10. Yes this would involve trusting the owner a bit and would cause a small drop in stock at the factory but this would be a good way of saying 'thank you' to those that pre-ordered and it would return the trust shown in us when we put all our deposits down long before the Movi came out. You could of course add a financial penalty to those who do not return their M10s within the window to ensure that returns are not delayed.
     
  2. Mike Reid

    Mike Reid Member

    Joined:
    Jul 14, 2013
    Messages:
    126
    Likes Received:
    11
    You'll get an RMA, so at the very most you may have to pay customs on the $3000 upgrade, but not the total cost of the unit since you've already paid for that when you got your M10.

    I feel your pain on shipping though. Even shipping into the US from Canada is awfully expensive.
     
  3. Angus Benson-Blair

    Angus Benson-Blair Active Member

    Joined:
    Jan 23, 2013
    Messages:
    148
    Likes Received:
    25
    If anything I am more worried about the time of shipping to, time to upgrade and shipping back....
     
  4. Ben Ruffell

    Ben Ruffell Active Member

    Joined:
    Jan 15, 2014
    Messages:
    227
    Likes Received:
    33
    This is my experience here in New Zealand.

    I really hope that Freefly has already begun talking with FedEx about this.

    RED have had a lot of trouble with this over the years… it has cost me a lot of time and money.

    The solution is for all of the shipping to be handled by FedEx. For all of the paperwork to be filled in correctly for the Country involved. (and different Countries have different terms for the return / upgrade process).

    Even then. Customs Department here does not really understand the concept of an 'upgrade' and due to the value that will be put down on the form… it is likely that full GST and Duty on the full amount will be due again.

    You will also need to dig out your original FedEx paperwork from the M10 purchase, along with the Customs documents proving that you paid for the taxes and duty.

    It is a hassle, and one tiny mistake or oversight by Freefly will make the process into a nightmare for those of us outside the USA.

    (My last experience with RED was so bad that it took several months to resolve… all due to an employee filling out one form incorrectly…)
     
  5. Hi Everyone. Thank you for the feedback and the suggestions on the upgrade process. As we work through the final details of the upgrade process you can be assured that we always consider the geographic location of all of our customers when making business decisions.

    Our current RMA process encompasses customers outside of the US and we don't usually have customs issues so the upgrade process (from a customs standpoint) would not be treated differently (from a shipping perspective) than other RMA work that is done. We would love if we had the resources to send M15s as loaners to everyone who is purchasing an upgrade but it is simply not feasible The standalone M15 is not due out until after the upgrades have been made publicly available and even then, we build in small batches to maintain quality. We will let everyone know once we have all the details finalized. Thank you (as always) for you continued patience while we work through a process to make this as smooth and efficient for everyone as possible.

    Cheers,
    Denise
     
  6. Charles Lim

    Charles Lim Member

    Joined:
    Aug 20, 2013
    Messages:
    308
    Likes Received:
    21
    any updates on the m15 upgrades?
     
  7. Hi Charles...We are still working through details but as soon as we have everything finalized we will let everyone know. We definitely appreciate everyone's patience as we know how anxious folks are for the upgrade.
     
  8. Augusto Alves da Silva

    Augusto Alves da Silva Active Member

    Joined:
    Apr 16, 2013
    Messages:
    202
    Likes Received:
    39
    Hi Denise:

    As you suggested I have contacted customer support about my M10 and all the updates made to the M5 which should be done on the M10 and haven´t received any answers. I e-mailed you directly and the customer support.Also the UK dealer that sold my M10 has sent you an e-mail. No answer like when I bought the C8. I wasn´t expecting this kind of treatment from Freefly. I think we deserve other treatment and some answers.

    Best regards
     
  9. Hello Augusto,

    While I didn't find any email from you to my direct email address, I did find tickets you sent into support and I do show that we responded and that you had a dialog with one of our Technical Support Engineers. The information they provided is similar to what I had provided here on the forums as that is what we have. We have also had multiple conversations with the dealer you purchased it from and have also provided them with the same information. I recognize that the information we provided to both of you may not be what you wanted to hear, and we can appreciate your frustration with that, but at this time there are no plans for free upgrades. We are working on additional options that will be available for purchase that you can upgrade yourself like the fully enclosed roll cage. The new lever adjustable pan knuckle is already available. There may be more to come as well but as I have explained, we do not yet have dates. While I apologize that we are not able to provide the news you would like, I do thank you for your candid feedback.

    Best Regards,
    Denise
     
  10. Ben Ruffell

    Ben Ruffell Active Member

    Joined:
    Jan 15, 2014
    Messages:
    227
    Likes Received:
    33
    Is anyone else thinking that the upgrade needs to be a significant improvement with a nice surprise?

    After the recent stress and hassles from Freefly I have realised that I can buy a Ronin for the cost of the upgrade, and have a complete, backup unit standing by in the workshop self contained in a nice professional case. I am a big fan of the MoVI and understand all of the differences between the units. But, at the end of the day… it could be a better option than the upgrade.

    It's a pretty cheap insurance policy.
     
  11. Charles Lim

    Charles Lim Member

    Joined:
    Aug 20, 2013
    Messages:
    308
    Likes Received:
    21
    hmmm. steep price for upgrade = steep expectations.
     
  12. Wolf Schiebel

    Wolf Schiebel Active Member

    Joined:
    Aug 15, 2012
    Messages:
    254
    Likes Received:
    67

    Ben, i'm really a big fan of the MōVI and was one of the first users in germany. I never had any issues. The biggest improvement in my opinion is the MōVI Ring, i never used the normal handlebar again, since i have it.

    BUT: I see a lot of problems for my business as MōVI operator because many dop's will just buy the Ronin and won't book me any more. So from the pure business point of view, i simply can't afford to upgrade the M-10, but am more or less forced to buy a Ronin for the same money instead. I already have the pan knuckle and the toad. My warranty lasts just another 3 month so maybe i will "upgrade" the M-10 with longer tubes and a cage myself, for sure nit as fancy as the original, but enough for my needs.

    That's not what i want to do, but it seems there is no alternative in my case. I simply can't spend that money when i can get another system with "only" the increased weight as flaw, even i don't agree with DJI's agressive price policy. Market is much more difficult in europe for operators and rental business.

    Best,

    Wolf
     
  13. Rob Drewett

    Rob Drewett Member

    Joined:
    Oct 6, 2013
    Messages:
    36
    Likes Received:
    21
    I sent this last week and did not get a response, I think it is time we start getting some questions answered!
    Hi Tabb,
    I hope all is well.
    In the last week the DJI Ronin has made quite an impact at the NHU BBC. Various productions are now investing
    in the DJI Ronin with the cheap price tag, the large payload (16lbs) and the ease in the ability to use it as a hot head.
    This has put me in a difficult situation, I now no longer have something that no one else has got.
    And although I knew at some stage this would happen I did not expect the leading competitor to be so cheap and give so much more.
    I am getting asked what can the MoVI do that the DJI Ronin can not and at the moment I am struggling to answer, could you please help me?
    I know the MoVI is lighter and Freefly has great customer service but try telling a production they should rent mine out for 30 days when they could buy 2 Ronins for the same price, is extremely hard
    Also I am having a hard time working out why I should pay $3000 + P&P for an upgrade when it is more expensive than a whole DJI Ronin rig and this comes with a nice Peli style case.
    The MoVI controller looks amazing and this is an angle I am trying to sell, that the precision of the MoVI is far superior but at $3500 I am again finding this a bit steep as yet again you could buy another DJI Ronin rig for the same.
    As an early pre-sales buyer I still a great supporter of Freefly equipment but I feel it is time for you to now deliver a bit more to your loyal customers, I have to stay competitive to give me the edge.
    Regards
    Rob
     
  14. Charles Lim

    Charles Lim Member

    Joined:
    Aug 20, 2013
    Messages:
    308
    Likes Received:
    21
    Rob your statement seem to make perfect sense. Any replies from freefly to justify the pricing for this upgrade?
    Perhaps freefly has good reason. But I have to say the silence from freefly, is rather unsettling.
     
  15. Jacob Schwarz

    Jacob Schwarz Member

    Joined:
    Sep 3, 2013
    Messages:
    68
    Likes Received:
    19
    I agree with you all about the DJI Ronin killing the low-end rental market, providing more features, offering more feature and hell iOS support (please Freefly come out with it soon), and even coming with case. I really wish that Freefly would all give us a free upgrade as well, but they won't and at the end of the day it is a non-issue for me because am SUPER HAPPY. So we should all stop trying to bully Freely and hanging this upgrade vs. Ronin things over their heads.

    I got my money out of M10. Great investment. I use it literally almost everyday. I have gone almost 6hours straight even without even putting the MOVI down expect for battery changes, and that why i'll upgrade to the M15 and pass on the DJI. The 9LB Ronin vs the 3LB MOVI is a huge deal. Hell Red charges a $10k premium for a carbon dragon and only saves you 1LB, we all paid a $12k premium for 6LB. For guys like me and most professionals that really use the 3-axis system as REAL tool, weight and ecosystem are going to pay a huge part when they rent and they'll always choice Freefly MOVI because it light weight and has a ecosystem for Drones, cablecams, Tero, etc. (try to attach a 9LB Ronin to a drone with a 10LB). The cheap guys are going to go with the DJI Ronin but the weight factor is going to catch up to everyone really fast. If you can only pull of a 5min shot over 20min handheld, or your drone can only fly for 5min vs 20min, people are going to spend the extra to rent a freefly system trust me. You guys that are worried about the whole rental market, just wait for the dust to settle and you'll see that you are going to still be renting your MOVI over the others pretty fast.
     
  16. Charles Lim

    Charles Lim Member

    Joined:
    Aug 20, 2013
    Messages:
    308
    Likes Received:
    21
    I guess for folks like us rigging the RED epic/dragon or Alexa M . The weight question is already beyond that point were we can carry it by hand all day .
    In many cases. The weight issue gets nullified when the gimbals are combined with a steadicam , serene with easyrig or equivalent to deal with the 4 axis. Unless there is a way to control the 4th axis with gyros while keeping the weight low. These methods will grain traction.
     
  17. Angus Benson-Blair

    Angus Benson-Blair Active Member

    Joined:
    Jan 23, 2013
    Messages:
    148
    Likes Received:
    25
    Well I guess this thread can be closed now as there is no upgrade path. :(
     
  18. Rod Hartzog

    Rod Hartzog Member

    Joined:
    Apr 16, 2013
    Messages:
    62
    Likes Received:
    9
    So if I'm to pay another 3000.00 to upgrade my M10 to an M15, as I had planned, I'd have 18,000 in a rig now worth only 12,000...if it were brand new. VERY disappointing move by FREEFLY. Unless I get a reasonable offer from FREEFLY to upgrade, I have bought my last FREEFLY product. I will go elsewhere and I will highly recommend to my peers that they do too. I was headed to Quadrocopter to build our 5th Cinestar but I'm seriously reconsidering. This is a tiny community and I never thought I would consider another manufacturer but FREEFLY, you just cheapened your products. You not only compete with the ronin and others like it now, you've effectively dropped yourself and your products from the top level to their levels.
     
    Aaranyan Ramanujam likes this.

Share This Page