Teradek Clip

Discussion in 'Video Assist & Video Accessories' started by Drew Kachurak, Sep 9, 2013.

  1. Andy Johnson-Laird

    Andy Johnson-Laird Administrator
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    Michael/Gary: What's the optimum placement of the Wifi router? Right by (or on) the ground station, a few feet away, or some other location?

    Andy.
     
  2. Michael Gailing

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    We typically keep it near the ground station, but we dont have any special best practices we follow.
     
  3. Adam Paugh

    Adam Paugh Distributor

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    Michael,

    How does the Clip determine resolution input? We first hooked up a GH3 and input displayed as 1080/60i on the App. Playback quality was acceptable, delay was nominal and range was roughly 200ft. Player load ~2200kbps. This was right out of the box using the hdmi pass through with smallHD dp4. Powering the Clip via splice off of MoVI 4s Aux pack.

    Next test was Red Scarlet...input on the App listed 1080/30p and playback quality experienced significant delay and frame drop on the bench. Player load~4800kbps.

    Next test was NEX-6n with similar results as the Scarlet. We are using an iPad 4 with hyperTHIN hdmi cables. We experimented with both the manual and auto quality and buffer settings on all three tests.

    Greetings,
    Adam
     
  4. Michael Gailing

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    Hey Adam,

    Thanks for the feedback. I've passed your information onto our engineers to take a look at. The jump in delay is a little weird since only interference should cause that, not the video camera. Was Clip on the 2.4 or 5GHz band when you tested this? What was the video quality set to on the iOS app? Did you have any other features enabled, such as IntraRefresh? And finally, how many devices were trying to view the feed at the same time?

    Ill follow up shortly with anything I hear from the others back at the office. If you need anything in the meantime, email me: mike [at] teradek [dot] com.
     
  5. Gary Haynes

    Gary Haynes Administrator
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    Similar results as Adam. Did several tests.

    1. CLIP up on the edge of my porch support column (no metal) connected to a Sony NEX7. Walked across the back yard. Started to lose the signal when the iPad showed 2 bars of WiFi strength. Distance was about 125 feet. If I rotated the iPad to a vertical position i got more WiFi signal bars but the CLIP app only works in landscape mode.

    2. Tested closer, 30-50 ft and it works flawlessly.

    3. Set it up in Infrastructure mode for connection to a WiFiRanger Router connected to a Ubiquiti Bullet M2. This is a 2.4gHz only router. This combination is what I use while camping to pull in better WiFi reception. Example with just the WFR and my test location I saw about 5 WiFi points. With the Bullet connected I got 42. My test spot was line of sight, slightly downhill and 930 feet away. While I did get a signal and image it was unusable due to long delays time in the 3000ms + range.

    So works well close in. But at least on 2.4gHz is not usable with the WFR system. Bummer....
     
  6. Chris Fox

    Chris Fox Active Member

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    Bugger, this was the solution I was hoping to use this week .......
     
  7. Gary Haynes

    Gary Haynes Administrator
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    Yeah me too. Might work closer in but I am also concerned on a copter operating anything at 2.4gHz that could mess with the RC control system. DJI sent out a warning about using the WiFi in the GoPro's after the Hero3 came out with built in WiFi and there were reported flyaways, come home to China issues.

    Unfortunately WiFiRanger doesn't make a 5.0gHz system. So a normal wireless router that does 5.0gHz combined with an M5 Bullet at 5.0gHz and the requisite Power of Ethernet injector would be next. But I think I will wait until Michael gives some guidance.
     
  8. Chris Fox

    Chris Fox Active Member

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    Agreed, I'm just after something that works, I would have tried one of the HD systems already out there, except there is not a lot of feedback that they work successfully and reliably and they do cost a lot, however getting something that just works would be worth it in the time it saves, trying different solutions and ending up with a workshop full of hopeful ideas and left over pieces.

    If I keep running around this merry-go-round the cobham solutions will start to look affordable
     
  9. Steve Maller

    Steve Maller UAV Grief Counselor

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    I am planning to do a test tomorrow with the GH3 on my Cinestar using an Airport Extreme. Very curious.

    Any thoughts as to the best place to mount the Clip on the CS8 airframe (2-axis gimbal)?
     
  10. Chris Fox

    Chris Fox Active Member

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  11. Sam Fleishman

    Sam Fleishman Member

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    Hey Mike,
    What's the return policy on the clip?
     
  12. Steve Maller

    Steve Maller UAV Grief Counselor

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    Ooops, well, no testing today. Next weekend I hope.
     
  13. Michael Gailing

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    Hey Sam,

    Return policy is 30 days for a full refund as long as the unit is returned in perfect condition.

    Im sorry about the poor performance on the 2.4GHz band, but please be aware that this is common for any device that operates on such a congested band.

    Im not an engineer so I can't provide much more info at this time. Im still pushing for a list of solid dual band routers for use with this device. Ill keep you all posted as soon as I get more information.
     
  14. Chris Fox

    Chris Fox Active Member

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    I've been doing some hunting around for a solution to get the desired level of performance, and was thinking about a 2.4ghz and 5ghz ubiquiti bullet and using a router capable of doing simultaneous dual band transmission like the edimax br-6475nd http://www.edimax.com/en/produce_detail.php?pd_id=381&pl1_id=3&pl2_id=18

    Any thoughts on if this may do the trick?
     
  15. Adam Paugh

    Adam Paugh Distributor

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    Hey Michael,

    It was set to 5gHz. I believe it was set up that way out of the box. We did not try anything in 2.4. I was sure to "close" all running apps on the iPad before setting up the Clip. Not sure about the status of "Insta-refresh"...not sure what that is, honestly.

    I can see where the development team is going with this product line. Cool iOS app for a wireless video link, similar to what DJI is doing with the Vision kopter. It certainly has marketing curb appeal and perhaps the new iPad with A7 processor will offer significant improvement.

    If focus control isn't a consideration, this appears to be a fairly P'nPlay setup for ground dual operator MoVI stuff.

    Greetings,
    Adam
     
  16. Michael Gailing

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    Hey Chris,

    Some of the guys here are shooting a best practices video for Clip as we speak so I hope that will answer some outstanding questions people have had about Clip. Keep in mind this is just the very beginning of the device - we have many things on the drawing board that will enhance range and general usability. When these accessories come out, you wont need to upgrade your Clip since everything will be compatible.

    I spoke at length to our head hardware engineer today and he recommended the Ubiquiti Rocket m5. If you use this as a standard access point, you can expect somewhere around 500+ feet in range (ill have a more specific number this week after we finish our tests). Since Clip does not have an Ethernet port, you cannot connect a WiFi extender to it such as the Bullet. Im not sure the Bullet can be used as a standard access point...

    Below is how some of the engineers here explained how Clip's WiFi range works:

    #1 - Clip direct to iPad
    -----You can expect 200 to 500ft+ in this setup. Best range is possible if you have the iPad antenna pointed directly at Clip. To do this, you usually have to be facing perpendicular to the Clip (we'll have a video showing this sometime this week). Unfortunately, Apple decided to place the antennas right next to the Home button on iPads so to get the best range you cannot face Clip head on.----

    #2 - Clip to iPad using an Access Point
    ----This will get you slightly better range since the router/access point has a higher output than an iPad does. This also means you can move around freely with your iPad, instead of having to face your Clip/copter at a certain direction (since Clip's feed is going over a router, not direct to the iPad). Placing patch antennas on both the Clip and router will increase range substantially, but this depends on which antennas you use and the output power of your router.----

    #3 - Clip to iPad using WiFi extenders and access point
    ----This is not possible...yet. In this setup, Clip has a WiFi extender like the Bullet connected to it via Ethernet. On the ground, there is a matching access point (this is a typical directional setup for Ubiquiti Bullets and Rockets). This will get you the greatest range, upwards of 3000ft. This is also how our own homegrown extender will work (albeit much smaller parts and lower power). If you must get the best range, our Cube encoder can already work in this configuration with Ubiquiti gear. You would only need to use a Cube 105 or Cube 205 since the Ethernet out on these units would go into the Bullet or Rocket. If you need the built-in WiFi on Cube, then the Cube 155 or 255 will suit your needs.----

    Note: our extender, when it comes out, will connect to Clip's RP-SMA connectors, not Ethernet.
     
  17. Michael Gailing

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    A quick update:

    A couple of the guys here and I connected a Clip to a Ubiquiti Rocket m5 + AMO-5g10 antenna (10 dbi). This setup operates over the 5GHz band. We got over 1000ft without having line of sight (w/ the Rocket being equidistant between the iPad and Clip). In fact, we walked through trees, cars, and around a building and still achieved this distance.

    Video coming very soon.

    http://dl.ubnt.com/datasheets/airmaxomni/amo_ds_web.pdf
     
  18. Jack Klink

    Jack Klink New Member

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    Just got my new Clip! So excited. I really hope that a VLC or other Teradek application will eventually support the stream. It will make this way more useful. I can confirm that the WireCast plugin does not currently support the clip because it is expecting an RTSP stream which the clip cannot provide.

    [​IMG]
     
  19. Michael Gailing

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    Hey Jack,

    Hope you enjoy the Clip!

    The Wirecast Stream Reader plugin can receive RTSP or TDS feeds (of which Clip supports). I've not tested it yet, but it may work. Were you using the Wirecast version of the plugin which is now deprecated?
     
  20. Gary Haynes

    Gary Haynes Administrator
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    Michael what router were you using with the Rocket M5?
     

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