Movi Pro powering off at 45%

Discussion in 'MōVI Pro' started by Rick Gerard, Aug 30, 2017.

  1. Rick Gerard

    Rick Gerard Active Member

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    I set up my Movi Pro with a Sony A7s2 yesterday. Powered the camera with the AUX D-tap port, used the center camera D-tap to power an Atomos Shogun Inferno and the Aux d-tap to power a TERADEK Bolt 500. Mimic was running and I had Bush Pilot running the focus. I should mention that the outside temperature was 104º F

    When the batteries reached about 45% the rig shut down automatically. As far as I can tell the total power draw was within specifications. I changed one of the batteries and everything came back up immediately but when the second battery reached about 45% the rig shut down again.

    I'm assuming that this has something to do with the current draw (amps) goes up as voltage goes down and the automatic safety features of the Movi pro, but it also may have something to do with the heat.

    I ended up disconnecting the Atomos Shogun and running batteries because that is the highest power draw so I could finish the shoot.

    Any thoughts. Anyone else using the MoviPro in 100+º heat having problems.
     
  2. Graham Futerfas

    Graham Futerfas Well-Known Member

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    I'd contact support about it, and make a video if possble.

    My first observation is that normally, when you draw too much power from one of the ports, it just shuts down the DTap port, not the whole Movi. Obviously the 2nd thing you can try is disconnecting the Shogun or the Teradek and see if that helps.

    Did you check the motor temperatures in the Monitor\diagnostics? Any warnings?

    Please let us know what you find out! I think there are data logs that you can get off the SD card inside the Movi, but probably need to send to support for them to read.
     
  3. Rick Gerard

    Rick Gerard Active Member

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    I can run the batteries down if disconnect the Shogun from the Dtap... Unfortunately the only log file I have shows only the last power cycle. I did not see any warnings, the entire rig just shut down and would not power back up until I removed and installed a battery. If I unplugged one of the batteries and plugged it back in the rig would power up again and run for a couple of minutes.

    I'll to some more testing this evening.
     
  4. Jake Wilganowski

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    I just had 3 batteries act like your description. They no longer work. My 5 others work fine. Is it happening with ALL your batteries?
     
  5. Rick Gerard

    Rick Gerard Active Member

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    If I unplug the batteries and put them back in they work for about 10 minutes and then power off again. I'm running some more tests tonight. Jake, did your batteries completely die or can you recharge? Were you working at +100º F?
     
  6. Jake Wilganowski

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    No, normal temps. I've been using 8 batteries for a few months. On my last shoot 3 died when showing plenty of charge. Upon further testing I can confirm these 3 will not power the movi for more than 10 minutes. I just ordered 3 more from movi and bought the movi power adapter from ignite digi.
     
  7. Graham Futerfas

    Graham Futerfas Well-Known Member

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    Hi Jake, I'm curious what battery are you using with the Ignite power adapter? 24 volt block battery or 12V? I've been on the fence about purchasing it because I'm not sure how I'd use it. Apparently if you go 12V, you need high-capacity batteries (120+wH), which isn't something I'm interested in carrying or mounting to my rig.

    I did have a director who wanted to do a single-take feature film, and I was considering them as a solution for hot-swap via cable by an AC without touching the Movi. If I was doing more vehicle-work or using the Movi as a hot-head all the time, it might make sense.
     
  8. Jake Wilganowski

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    I haven't received it yet. I have a bunch of different wattage gold mount batteries. I plan on using it for jib work or when the movi is mounted mostly. And for handheld as a backup if the movi batteries fail. After having 3 go bad cant feel confident not having a backup solution
     
  9. Rick Gerard

    Rick Gerard Active Member

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    I did some more testing last night. Turns out that the rig shuts down randomly. Disconnecting the Shogun seemed to help. I have 4 batteries and none of them have more than about 20 charge cycles on them yet.

    One way to guarantee a quick shut down is to rig the camera just slightly out of balance, and I mean just slightly, so that when you take your hand off the ring after tuning you get the high frequency vibration that sometimes happens, then it goes away as soon as you touch the ring again. I'm talking about having the Move sitting on it's feet on the bench.

    Now let go of the ring and get a little vibration going and within a couple of seconds you get a critical battery warning and a shut down. Checking the power of the batteries I was showing all but one of the lights and the power showed above 80% on both batteries. The rig will not power up unless you remove the batteries and replace them.

    With the Shogun and the Bolt 500 powered by the rig and the motors paused the batteries will drop from 80% to 45% in about 2 minutes then the rig shuts down. Unplug the batteries and plug them back in and It's back to 80%. Tried the test again and when the batteries got down to about 65% after less than a minute I turned off the Shogun and the batteries came back to about 78%, almost the starting voltage.

    I worked with the rig for about an hour trying various routines. I'll try and film some of this testing later today. I think it's a software problem. I'm going to rig a volt meter to one of the batteries so I can actually see the voltage and compare it to the battery indicator on the rig. I think the high frequency vibration has something to do with it. On my rig it takes a lot of tweaking to balance the rig so that it doesn't vibrate if left on the bench without a hand on the ring someplace.

    What version of the firmware are we supposed to be running. I may be behind on a version. I don't dare take the rig on a set right now because I can't count on it to work. On a side note, surely there is something that can be done about the high frequency vibration issue. I've had to deal with it from day one. I can always get rid of it by placing may hand on the ring or by holding the Movi but if my hand is stopping it it's there wasting energy.
     
  10. Graham Futerfas

    Graham Futerfas Well-Known Member

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    No matter what firmware you're running, this sounds like an issue to sort out with support. That doesn't sound like normal Movi behavior, and I'm sure they'll want to see a video of the problem.

    Unless I misunderstand your question, getting rid of high frequency vibrations is pretty easy with the app on your phone. You can open the Tuning section and see the red meter vibrating on whatever axis has the noise. Either decrease stiffness or increase filter a little bit to get rid of it. It can also happen if your hold strengths are set high. I find I'm often de-noising the Movi on set with the app throughout the day as shots change, lenses change, etc.
     
  11. Rick Gerard

    Rick Gerard Active Member

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    I did a bunch more testing. Turns out that the HF noise is not the problem. It appears to be the combination of battery 1 and 2.

    Here's what I did this morning. First, updated firmware and then powered up with battery 1 and 2 in the holders. Turned on the Shogun and the Bolt. Monitored the batteries on the iOS app and the Movi. Both batteries started out close to 90% but started to run down very quickly. I just had the rig setting on the bench. Ran trough FIZ calibration with the Mimic and Bush Pilot, turned on the mimic and started moving the camera around. The battery was quickly dropping to 60%. After about 15 more minutes the batteries were down to just under 45% and then all of a sudden- shutdown.

    This time I replaced battery 1 with battery 3 and powered up the Movi again. I had to remove and replace bat 1 to get it to show up on the monitor. Now both batteries were showing about 90% and the app was showing 87%. Very same routine as before but I played with the Movi, ran around the room, turned the Mimic on and off and worked for about 45 minutes before both batteries showed about 28%. I parked the Movi on the bench and waited and watched. When the iOS app showed 8% I powered down the unit and replaced the batteries with 2 and 4. Same results exactly.

    I then charged battery 1 and 2 for about an hour, ran the same test again and after about 30 minutes the rig was down to 45% power then it shut down again. Pulled out the batteries, returned them to the Movi and the battery level went up to about 58%, stayed there for a couple of minutes then the low battery warning and a shutdown.

    So I don't know what is going on with battery 1 and 2 but when they are used at the same time I can only get about 30 minutes out of the Movi and it shuts down right after the monitored battery level goes below 45%.

    Really weird, but that is what is going on. As long as I'm using battery 1 and 3 or 4 or battery 2 and 3 or 4 I get normal battery life and can power everything on the rig. 1 and 2 fail within about 30 minutes.

    Any warranty on batteries? Probably should have bought them from B&H and covered the batteries for 3 years.

    I'll do some more testing tomorrow and make a video... Weird.....
     
  12. Gary Haynes

    Gary Haynes Administrator
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    Rick do you have a LiPo battery tester? You can see individual cells with a tester. Maybe bat 1 and 2 have a bad cell.
     
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  13. Graham Futerfas

    Graham Futerfas Well-Known Member

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    Thanks Rick, very interesting.

    I know the Movi somehow simultaneously drains the two batteries, so maybe if one is bad, it can affect the other?

    Gary, how do you plug a Movi Pro battery into a LiPo tester? Is there a balance lead hiding in there?
     
    #13 Graham Futerfas, Aug 31, 2017
    Last edited: Sep 1, 2017
  14. Gary Haynes

    Gary Haynes Administrator
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    My bad on the LiPo tester. Thinking non Pro battery with the old balance leads.
     
  15. Graham Futerfas

    Graham Futerfas Well-Known Member

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    I'm sure there's a way to make an adapter for Movi Pro batteries that could offer balance leads though. After your post, I even looked at one of them to see if I could shove my LiPo checker in there somehow. :)
     
  16. Rick Gerard

    Rick Gerard Active Member

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    What I need to get my tester to work is a wiring diagram for the Movi batteries. It looks like there are 2 tabs with four contacts per tab. The question is what goes to what. It would be real easy to blow up a battery by shoving things in there.

    What does the FreeFly service department use? Maybe we could buy an adaptor.

    Still having issues today. I tried leaving battery 1 and 2 on a charger all night to see if the cells would balance out. The only thing I know for sure is that the battery meters on the Movi are not accurate. Plug on battery at 30% in and another at 100% and both meters will read somewhere around 78% so you can't really tell what each battery is doing.
     
  17. Jake Wilganowski

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    yout problem is EXACTLY how mine was acting, I took 3 batteries out of my kit

    Interested to see what u find out with further testing
     
  18. Rick Gerard

    Rick Gerard Active Member

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    Does anyone have a wiring diagram for the Movi Pro batteries? I've come up with a way to modify a connector to mate up with the two tabs but I Have no idea what each pin goes to.

    I don't want to be poking around with a meter or throw a tester in there without knowing where the pins go and if there is a balancing lead...
     
  19. Gary Haynes

    Gary Haynes Administrator
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  20. Graham Futerfas

    Graham Futerfas Well-Known Member

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    You could also ask the guys at Ignite Digi Australia. They made a Movi Pro Power Adapter and might have a diagram. I remember Tabb saying the Movi Pro batteries use some standard off-the-shelf connector(s), but I could be wrong. Ali Express or some website like that might carry them.
     

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