MOVI -- Competitors

Discussion in 'MōVI M10' started by Lliam Worthington, Sep 4, 2013.

  1. Lliam Worthington

    Joined:
    Jul 18, 2013
    Messages:
    51
    Likes Received:
    2
    So, there's definitely a lot of them. Well done FF.

    I felt MOVI was clearly a cut above other emerging products until only more recently with some compelling ones starting to shape up - the REDuser group buy for the BeSteady sounding like one such to me - and with quite a few making claims such as "will be as good as the MOVI" and the like, and all without exception having much lower price points, I'm very interested in hearing Freeflys informed opinion on those statements, your thoughts on the emerging market, and what you feel will best distinguish MOVI as the flag ship of brushless gimbals stabilisers, in accordance with it's higher price point.

    Perhaps without seeing these units, it's just too hard to say that much... But I imagine FF must have spent a great amount of time pondering the MOVI's future in the marketplace and upon the wave of competition it's engendered. I know you guys are time poor, but at this point in the race, it strikes me as a pretty good time to perhaps share a few of these key thoughts with your pre orders?

    In short, comments of "you get what you paid for" and the how of that, would be music to my ears :) Otherwise, even just some musing on how much work is going into the secret sauce of the MOVI would be nice to hear.

    Thanks for your time.
    Kind Regards

    Lliam
     
  2. Adam Paugh

    Adam Paugh Distributor

    Joined:
    Jun 29, 2012
    Messages:
    323
    Likes Received:
    78
    Speaking from an owners perspective (of a MoVI rig) I think that the one main advantage is that all the hardware components, PCB/software and GUI are all coming from one place. Many of these other gimbals that you are referring to have frane parts made by one company, a control board(s) and motors from two separate companies and an open source, project-based utility.

    It appears that BeSteady is being its climb out of open source software with some custom electronics (Facebook post from 21hrs ago). I guess that Kickstarter cash is starting to go to work.

    Greetings,
    Adam
     
    Drew Kachurak likes this.
  3. Charles Lim

    Charles Lim Member

    Joined:
    Aug 20, 2013
    Messages:
    308
    Likes Received:
    21
    The MoVI is 15k.
    The BS4 is 6k
     
  4. Angus Benson-Blair

    Angus Benson-Blair Active Member

    Joined:
    Jan 23, 2013
    Messages:
    148
    Likes Received:
    25
    News on what sets this apart from some of the competitors would be very good to hear. I would hazard a guess that some people might be having second thoughts on pulling the trigger with a Movi over some of the emerging designs and some news might revert those second thoughts.
     
  5. Robert Marks

    Robert Marks Member

    Joined:
    Aug 22, 2013
    Messages:
    60
    Likes Received:
    2
    I am happy to see that the BeSteady guys are now including a modded alexmos version in their rig which brings them closer to the Mövi. In my opinion the difficult part is the electronics and software side. Both systems are absolutely comparable in specs. Custom motors, electronics, bluetooth app., follow modes, toolfree adjustments etc.

    Where I am not sure is the performance side. I have several brushless gimbals here and their main difference is the software. For example if you compare a 2 axis gopro gimbal from DJI with one running on alexmos and simplebgc the difference is obvious. The DJI never needs calibration and keeps perfect horizon, always. The alexmos wants calibration pretty often, so bring a laptop. Also the alexmos gimbal sometimes drifts so you loose horizon etc.

    For a RC guy this might be acceptable. What the pro movie user wants is something that works out of the box and does not need a lot of knowhow and maintenance. I am pretty sure that Freefly is aware of this but the others are closing up fast (and comparably cheap).

    Just my opinion!
     
    Lliam Worthington likes this.
  6. Wolf Schiebel

    Wolf Schiebel Active Member

    Joined:
    Aug 15, 2012
    Messages:
    254
    Likes Received:
    67
    Don´t forget that it might take another 6 months for Besteady to come to a comparable product that is ready for delivery. They didn´t even start delivery of the "One", and not even beta-testing of the "Four".
    FF have an advantage of about 6 month of testing and modifying and are able to deliver a rugged, proven and "finished" product. There is no other system with the payload yet, and while it is not a real problem to get a "beta-stage" product running for us RC-people, it will be a big challenge for the average movie professionals.
    So i think FF´s leading position is not really endangered at the moment and in the nearer future, at least regarding the pro market.

    My 2 cents.....
     
  7. Carey Lee Coffey

    Joined:
    Jul 13, 2013
    Messages:
    194
    Likes Received:
    16
    My focus is not on the product itself, but on the end result. If product A. can get the same results as product B., then I have to look at other factors like: customer service, price, estimated shipping dates, included accessories, future plans etc.
     
  8. James Adkins

    James Adkins Member

    Joined:
    Apr 13, 2013
    Messages:
    158
    Likes Received:
    21
    Wolf,

    The Colibri carries the Epic
     
  9. Howard Dapp

    Howard Dapp Active Member

    Joined:
    Aug 18, 2012
    Messages:
    977
    Likes Received:
    111
  10. Carey Lee Coffey

    Joined:
    Jul 13, 2013
    Messages:
    194
    Likes Received:
    16

    BeSteady:

    "...We're not using stock alexMos boards for any of our devices and our electronics are being rigorously tested to perform flawlessly. Also, and most importantly, the BeSteady Four will use custom electronics built around ARM processor technology. The same processor types used in smart phones. It's a huge leap in power and capability, and means performance will be blistering fast and precise... Having consistent horizon is a high priority when we measure performance and the Four will perform exceptionally, even at high speeds. There's definitely no comparison to the AlexMos simple BGC. We'll know exactly how much force it will be able to take during testing but we're expecting it will be able to withstand forces up to 3Gs"
     
  11. Robert Marks

    Robert Marks Member

    Joined:
    Aug 22, 2013
    Messages:
    60
    Likes Received:
    2
    Thats why i wrote :
    Thanks for your information Carey! Your details about the BeSteady Four sound great.
     
  12. Carey Lee Coffey

    Joined:
    Jul 13, 2013
    Messages:
    194
    Likes Received:
    16
    It will be an interesting year!
     
  13. Lliam Worthington

    Joined:
    Jul 18, 2013
    Messages:
    51
    Likes Received:
    2
    Thanks Adam. Could you extrapolate on that a little? Do you mean that would likely mean better QC, supply, warranty/replacements?

    Yeah i think so too.


    I contacted those guys a while ago, they never got back to me.

    I also contacted the Colibri guys, they were very nice, I asked a lot of questions and concluded the MOVI was a superior product.

    Yeah, this echoes my own thoughts, and history teaches delays should be expected.

    Really appreciate all the thoughts btw. Hoping to hear FF's thoughts also...
     
  14. Chris Babiana

    Chris Babiana Member

    Joined:
    Nov 8, 2012
    Messages:
    183
    Likes Received:
    15
    BeSteady has a US rep located in New England. I've know him for a while and they sold out of the first batch quickly. The pre-order you see on this site is for the second shipment. He has had noting but high reviews on the product. FF is seemingly a great product, but waaaaaaay out of my budget, as I'm sure many others. I'll be paying him a visit upon delivery of the next shipment to give one a test drive.
    http://www.liquidskycinema.com/besteady.php
     
  15. Brett Harrison

    Brett Harrison Active Member

    Joined:
    Apr 7, 2013
    Messages:
    299
    Likes Received:
    40
    Warning: fanboy rantings below

    I think one of the best features of this system is that they made it to the finish line first. This speaks volumes. It might be superficial but their image, name, associations - all 'features'.

    I can't speak to comparisons (which is already saying something; the reviews aren't out yet). However I believe that the amount of orders is in the many hundreds. That's a nice amount of capital they just secured. They're first across the line, they've completed the production 'circuit', so now they just focus on fulfillment and the next development cycle. Remember they said they didn't expect this amount of concrete interest.

    The difference in price is negligible to the advantages gained by an early association with this device, and the improvements down the line are going to be monumental, and I am guessing it will all have to do with extending the software features and adding auxiliary devices for tracking, recording, different interfaces. Freefly get to focus on that stuff first.

    And let's wait to see how competitors go with telephoto focal lengths, too.
     
  16. Brad McGiveron

    Brad McGiveron Active Member

    Joined:
    Jul 7, 2012
    Messages:
    396
    Likes Received:
    65
    Everybody and their donkey seems to be in on the brushless race currently which reminds me of a very old movie " Its a mad mad mad mad world".
    X does mark the spot and its achievable for many because this stuff just isn't rocket science quite yet. Looking back in 10 years we are all going to have a chuckle at the vimeo ads and postings of potential products and folks standing in front of mirrors.
    If it hasn't happened already, one of the big players is going to step in and take this over because its just a little too silly that mere mortals are actually having a free go at making millions... uninterrupted as well. Its all kind of cute and cuddly.

    I see it now ... "The Nikon Movi" or "Nikon Be Steady Shot" :D




    btw this is the movi I was talking about
     
  17. Gary Haynes

    Gary Haynes Administrator
    Staff Member

    Joined:
    Jul 6, 2012
    Messages:
    5,211
    Likes Received:
    460
    Brad that movie and Cat Balou were two of my dad's favorites. In the vain of Airport many years later, roger, Roger!
     
    Brad McGiveron likes this.
  18. Brad McGiveron

    Brad McGiveron Active Member

    Joined:
    Jul 7, 2012
    Messages:
    396
    Likes Received:
    65
    Hehe... yes it was one of my Dad's favorites as well.

    Ah Cat Balou ! Nothing like a shoot em up slapstick comedy.
     
  19. Tabb Firchau

    Tabb Firchau Administrator
    Staff Member

    Joined:
    Jun 28, 2012
    Messages:
    911
    Likes Received:
    472
    Hi Guys,

    I wanted to give a quick list of features that we feel differentiate the MōVI from competitors. The below contains a lot of technical details about the various sub-systems on the MōVI. The sum of these systems is a robust, reliable and adaptable camera stabilizer that works in real world filming conditions. We have kept pretty tight lipped about what separates the MōVI from the rest of the pack until now. What this means for our customers is that they will have a system which will allow them to focus on shooting and shot design rather then endless hours of tweaking and gain adjustments. The MōVI does not just carry a camera like the Red EPIC; it does it easily. The MōVI can accelerate and slew a Red EPIC and ultra prime lens at 150 deg/sec, while other systems using sensor-less motor drives struggle. This is important as it directly relates to your ability to accurately and precisely command the camera. The MōVI design team features 10 engineers who are all at the top of their respective fields. These industry experts all working together to re-define camera movement.

    I know a lot of people are desperate to believe that our competitors (I use the term loosely as the majority do not even have a product, just a rendering) are just as good as a MōVI at 1/3rd the cost. I am guessing as these systems are released and things shake out a bit and actual users get their hands on them, you will notice an overwhelming trend. The MōVI will continue to produce the stable shots it has become known for and you will see a lot of wobbly, vibrating footage from others.

    Motors
    • Motors designed and built in house by engineers at Freefly
    • Low weight and high torque - can stabilize larger cameras
    • Excellent heat dissipation
    • High-resolution shaft position encoder
    • Sealed design
    • Zero maintenance
    • Integrated into the structure
    • Large face-mount shaft for high stiffness
    • Extremely low cogging torque
    Motor Drive Electronics
    • Designed in house - optimized for our custom motors
    • Sensored control - High peak torque in all situations
    • Silent drive technology
    • Highest quality components
    • 3 x 32bit ARM microcontrollers
    • Precise motion control in any position
    • Low voltage protection
    • Overcurrent protection
    • Motor temperature monitoring and protection
    Stabilizer Control System
    • Each hand calibrated at the factory
    • Majestic Mode - the most extensively tested single-operator control
    • GPS attitude correction
    • High performance 32bit ARM microcontroller
    • High quality GPS
    • Barometer for advanced position information
    • Data logging for VFX post
    • Highest quality stabilization algorithm developed by experts in UAV stability and control
    • Robust control where any disturbance is quickly rejected
    • Android, PC, and MacOS programming options
    • Firmware upgradeable
    • Advanced live graphing
    • Bluetooth (wireless) parameter adjustment
    • Automatic setup for camera top or bottom mount
    • Automatic gimbal inverted option for steadicam use
    • Support for Spektrum and JR Remote Receiver protocol, Futaba S.Bus for second-operator control
    Stabilizer Structure
    • Low weight
    • Easy to adjust (standard adjustment is toolless)
    • Easy/quick camera removal (<10s)
    • Fold for shipping
    • Wide camera tray, fits larger cameras
    • Quickly changes from handheld to multirotor use
    • Hollow tilt shaft, allows wide range of tilt motion without wire tangling
    • Easily adapts to almost any camera
    Hope that helps give some insight as to why we think the MōVI is in a class of it's own.
    Tabb
     
  20. Brett Harrison

    Brett Harrison Active Member

    Joined:
    Apr 7, 2013
    Messages:
    299
    Likes Received:
    40
    That you were able to keep quiet about all that for this long is pretty impressive!
     

Share This Page