Figuring out Movi 4S batteries for Rapid Charge

Discussion in 'Batteries & Power' started by Orlando Briones, Dec 9, 2014.

  1. Orlando Briones

    Orlando Briones New Member

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    I got this from Progressive RC
    http://www.progressiverc.com/the-sidekick-ticket-350w-combo.html

    I am waiting to get parrallel connectors, because I have been told they do not carry a JST with 4S parallel charge board.

    On the back of the Movi 4S batteries for my Movi M10, it says they should not be charged more than 2C. Since they are rated at 2.6, im not charging them faster than 5.0amps. Is it possible to charge them any faster with out damaging them? I don't like having to wait almost 30-45min for each battery to charge. I have a set of 4 of them and would like to find a nice rapid charging solution. Any feedback would be much appreciated! Thanks again!
     
  2. Andy Johnson-Laird

    Andy Johnson-Laird Administrator
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    Orlando:
    The general answer is that you probably can charge them at more than 5.0 Amps, however, experience has shown when you do this:

    1. The actual useful charge you will get back out of the batteries will be lower.
    2. If you charge them with too much current, the batteries will let you know their displeasure by bursting into flame.

    Therefore I would stay at 5.0 Amps. The way around the problem of having to wait is to just have more batteries -- but then you've figured that out! :)

    Andy.
     
  3. Orlando Briones

    Orlando Briones New Member

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    That's what I figured. Thanks Andy. Here goes to buying more movi 4s batteries.
     
  4. Derek Cooper

    Derek Cooper Active Member

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    Consider other batteries - we replaced our Movi batteries with Pulse batteries a while back with great success.
     
  5. Orlando Briones

    Orlando Briones New Member

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    Derek,

    I found these:
    http://www.lipomall.com/pulse-lipo-4s-2250mah-14-8v-45c-ultrapower-battery-plu45-22504.htm

    I have a couple of questions:

    1. Did you buy the pulse batt with the JST connector or did you crimp them yourself? Or did you convert your movi to a different power connector?

    2. Since these have a charge rate of 5C, then theoritcally i could charge them fully in about 5 min each?!
    3.
    I'm currently using the Movi Batteries to power my Epic or any other camera via dtap. Would these be ok to run the epic as well?

    I def like this route instead dropping more cash on the movi brand batteries.

    Thank you for your time!
     

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  6. Derek Cooper

    Derek Cooper Active Member

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    1. Those are what we buy. Powers Movi M10 and Paralinx Arrow X TX simultaneously.

    2. They ship bare wire. We use deans connectors - prefer them over jst.

    3. No idea.
     
  7. Orlando Briones

    Orlando Briones New Member

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    Derek,

    Do you have a pretty fast charge rate with them? Do you know about how long they take to recharge? I'm looking to see how many I should buy and start with.
     
  8. Derek Cooper

    Derek Cooper Active Member

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    Yup - the Pulse batteries are terrific. I can't remember what we charge them at, but they are quick. Here's our charging station... very happy with it after many iterations. Can't say enough about the FMA PowerLab family of chargers. When coupled with a high DC 24V supply like the eFuel, it's just awesome. We use pairs of Pulse 16,000 mAh 6S cells on the drone and they re-charge in parallel at 20 amps each, usually less than 15 minutes. Awesome.

    And when we're away from ground power, we just go right off a vehicle battery to the PowerLab.

    IMG_0049.JPG
     
  9. Patrick Rebstock

    Patrick Rebstock New Member

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    hey guys im looking to get a m5 battery to use for astro timelapse that will last a long time
    i have been using the akira firmware to use the movi like a timelapse head and i have killed my m5 battery because the voltage got too low
    I want to be able to shoot longer, Most of the night so i can recover the setup in the morning and still have power.
    I know that the lipos will die if run down too low so my idea is get a battery that is big enough to last all night and not get too low.
    I called freefly today and they did not recommend using other batteries but when pressed they said you could use a battery with the exact same specs but larger capacity, AKA 4s 14.8v and 3c discharge continuous and 5c peak discharge
    Im not sure why the discharge rate is so important and why it is so low on the movi batteries, but i cant find a lipo with that low of a discharge rate, any suggestions of what battery to use?
     
  10. Andy Johnson-Laird

    Andy Johnson-Laird Administrator
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    Patrick: Would you have access to 120v AC power? If so you could use a suitable bench supply that would provide a corresponding voltage and current to a LiPo.

    You could also perhaps achieve the same effect by creating an external battery pack with a flexible cable and using several LiPo batteries in parallel.

    I think you may find that the 3C discharge rate, where C is the capacity of the battery in Amp/Hours, may have been a minimum -- not a requirement for exactly 3C.

    Can you explain the physical setup you want -- will the M5 be tripod mounted, for example?

    Andy

    Forensic Software & sUAV / Drone Analyst : Photographer : Videographer : Pilot (Portland, Oregon, USA): Trees=2, Ground=1, Props=11. :(
    The Ground Is The Limit™
    ---------- Forensic Drone Analyst : Forensic sUAV Analyst : Forensic Unmanned Aircraft Analyst : Forensic Drone Expert
     
  11. Patrick Rebstock

    Patrick Rebstock New Member

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    Hey Andy,
    thanks for the response,
    I would not have access to ac power as i would be out in the mountains shooting on location
    Yeah all i want to do is use a large 4s lipo to power the movi, just want to make sure im not going to hurt it.
    seems like people on the forums are using normal lipos with large discharge rates of 45c like this one http://www.lipomall.com/pulse-lipo-4s-2250mah-14-8v-45c-ultrapower-battery-plu45-22504.htm
    but when i asked the tech support at freefly today they said specifically over and over again that i had to only use a battery that had a discharge rate of 3c continous and 5c peak like the m5 battery, and when i asked why that is they said because the movi is not a RC car?? (doesn't answer the question)
    I don't understand that line of thinking because if it doesn't need the power that fast it won't draw the power that fast, right?
    I already have 4s 14.8v packs from my drone that i want to use
     

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  12. Gary Haynes

    Gary Haynes Administrator
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    Patrick hook up your large battery. The MoVI will only pull the power it needs. Your thought of it pulls what it needs is spot on. But one caution for you. There is inherent drift in the MoVI. If you put it stationary on a tripod or stand and don't move it it will drift. This is a function of the sensors. They are pretty accurate but need some movement to stay accurate. Might have an affect on your setup plans.
     
  13. Andy Johnson-Laird

    Andy Johnson-Laird Administrator
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    Both you and Gary are correct. The C discharge rating is a measure of how much current the LiPo could supply without sustaining damage (and doubtless relates to its internal resistance too). The M5 does not know where its electrons are coming from -- all it "sees" is the voltage and it pulls as many electrons as it wants/needs for holding the motors still and powering the gimbal control unit and sensors.

    If your sUAV LiPo's are all of the same type and equivalent history then you can connect them in parallel to provide a much higher Amp/Hour capacity battery. So if you had, say, six 4S 6000 mAH Lipos in parallel then you would create a 36,000 mAH battery (aka 36 Amp/Hour).

    The reason for the same type/equivalent history is that you want to avoid the situation where some "healthier/younger" batteries in the group are, in effect, charging the "sicker/older" batteries -- there is the potential (sorry, electrical pun) for a high current to flow between batteries.

    EDIT: The reason for the above is that a "sicker/older" battery's voltage is likely to drop faster than the "healthier/younger" battery -- and that voltage difference matters because, when batteries are connected in parallel, all their positive terminals are connected together -- and all their negative terminals are connected together so each battery in a group is exposed to the voltage of all the other batteries and electronic arm-wrestling ensues.


    If anyone is uncertain how to wire batteries in parallel, check this page out: https://www.batterystuff.com/kb/articles/battery-articles/battery-bank-tutorial.html

    Hope this helps,
    Andy

    Forensic Software & sUAV / Drone Analyst : Photographer : Videographer : Pilot (Portland, Oregon, USA): Trees=2, Ground=1, Props=11. :(
    The Ground Is The Limit™
    ---------- Forensic Drone Analyst : Forensic sUAV Analyst : Forensic Unmanned Aircraft Analyst : Forensic Drone Expert
     
  14. Patrick Rebstock

    Patrick Rebstock New Member

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    that's awesome thanks! I have been shooting a lot of timelapse and haven't run into the drift issue, I am always shooting motion timelapse with this rig so maybe that hides it when it's moving. Plan on plopping the whole rig on s motion slider soon thanks
     
  15. Patrick Rebstock

    Patrick Rebstock New Member

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    Sw
    sweet I already have a handy parallel harness for my drone lipos, might make a longer lead to allow them to be tripod mounted instead of on movi
     
  16. Andy Johnson-Laird

    Andy Johnson-Laird Administrator
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    Perhaps if you could contrive to hang the LiPo group from the underside of the central column of the tripod it would make the whole assembly more stable.

    Andy

    Forensic Software & sUAV / Drone Analyst : Photographer : Videographer : Pilot (Portland, Oregon, USA): Trees=2, Ground=1, Props=11. :(
    The Ground Is The Limit™
    ---------- Forensic Drone Analyst : Forensic sUAV Analyst : Forensic Unmanned Aircraft Analyst : Forensic Drone Expert
     
  17. Patrick Rebstock

    Patrick Rebstock New Member

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    Problem solved thanks guys
    Going to make a longer extension lead for when I want to run two larger lipos in parallel and mount them to the tripod
     
  18. Patrick Rebstock

    Patrick Rebstock New Member

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    Pic
     

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