Anyone Else Run Into This Stuff???

Discussion in 'Announcements' started by Josh Lambeth, Aug 9, 2012.

  1. Josh Lambeth

    Josh Lambeth Well-Known Member

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    Not sure where to post this so I will post here.

    Have any of you other AP Companies run into people like this? If so how do you deal with it? I have not responded to this thread and this is now the 3rd thread I have come across started by the same person on multiple forums bashing my company and what we do... I have since removed the FAA stuff from our site (i do agree maybe I shouldn't have posted that) but besides that... not sure what to do... just ignore it and keep moving forward? Any insite would be great! Thanks guys!

    http://helifreak.com/showthread.php?t=435960

    Josh
     
  2. Gary Haynes

    Gary Haynes Administrator
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    Ignore the net. I did see your posting and maybe should have raised a hand to question the wording. That said, fly safe, dont annoy people and stay under the proverbial radar screen. While there are lots of opinions about the federal regulations and whether they apply in their current form to quadrocopters or other remote copters if someone comes knocking the cost to win would be prohibitive.

    Maybe someone else that is running a full on business can give you insight here or offline on how they are handling the situation.
     
  3. Josh Lambeth

    Josh Lambeth Well-Known Member

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    Thanks for the info Gary.
     
  4. MIke Magee

    MIke Magee Active Member

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    Your work is great Josh. Keep flying. I totally agree with Gary. Fly safe, fly smart - and above all fly safe. Most of those old-time rc heli guys wrestle with inherently unstable machines every day and just can't understand how we can do what we do. Ours are amazingly stable platforms. I might suggest that reducing your profile and showing the gear as little as possible - emphasizing the deliverable and not the technology, makes sense and helps keep you under the radar.
     
  5. Josh Lambeth

    Josh Lambeth Well-Known Member

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    Thanks Mike,
    I will be toning everything down a bit I think. We are really not wanting to get in trouble for this. Thanks for the info guys!

    Josh
     
  6. Tabb Firchau

    Tabb Firchau Administrator
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    Could not agree more Mike! Focus on the end product, not how it gets done. When I hire a general contractor I could care less what kind of nail gun he uses, I just know what I want the finished product to look like.

    Best,

    Tabb
     
  7. Bob Wojda

    Bob Wojda Member

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    The post above and the other thread on "Interesting Article" seems to be a serious threat to this business. This is the first forum that I've seen that seems to be dedicated to those that are doing Ariel Photography as part or all of their business. I'm not against having FAA direction but right now there isn't much guidance in any direction and almost no where to get information on what's happening. Instead we see posts like the link to one above which may or may not be valid but it will certainly impact Bird's Eye Production's bottom line.

    I am also concerned that someone is going to make a serious mistake and fly where normal safety is ignored. This could ruin it for everyone, especially if it became a story in the news and worst case, people get hurt. Having some licencing could help avoid this or at least show that such actions are not the norm.

    Tabb and some of the others here are certainly leaders in this creatively. Is this the right group to help inform us and possibly guide legislation in these areas?

    Bob
     
  8. Dwayne Griffiths

    Dwayne Griffiths New Member

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    Hey Josh,

    I am in the same boat as yourself, I recently "went all in" and bought myself a Cinestar 8 with the intent of selling aerial photos and video in the Dallas area. I just finished building it yesterday. I honestly think the FAA is just covering itself, I find it hard to believe they would spend the time prosecuting someone for taking Aerial photos or video with the type of setup we are using, Its pretty hard to justify when you can do the exact same thing without breaking their rules if you give the photos away for free. What if you take photos for fun then happen to sell some of them? Its pretty grey.
     
  9. Howard Dapp

    Howard Dapp Active Member

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    Gary & Mike have made some good points. To add to that, our industry is growing at an extraordinary rate and with any growing industry there are folks who grow green with envy when they see a potential competitor doing quality work. I suspect guys like this are probably behind the negative remarks made against Josh's company. Because of the grey area surrounding what we do, actually not so grey, more like dark blue, it's probably smart to not broadcast your services in any public online venue until the rules and regs are made more clear for us.
     
  10. Andrew Goodwin

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    Hey Guys, I'm curious how you guys get around this. We fly in Canada, and have to get Transport Canada permits in order to do it all legit, which we've done and continue to do. Doesn't being technically 'illegal' void any liability insurance you've got?

    Worst case scenario, something happens to/with kopter and someone gets hurt or property gets damaged. You get sued and make a claim with your insurance company, but the underwriters notice what you're doing is illegal. Are you not up the proverbial creek at that point? Does this not make you lose any sleep?
     
  11. gmango

    gmango New Member

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    I have a friend who is an attorney looking at the notice. I will get back to you.
     
  12. Josh Lambeth

    Josh Lambeth Well-Known Member

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    Im interested/scared to see what he comes up with. lol

    Josh
     
  13. Howard Dapp

    Howard Dapp Active Member

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    Basically yes, I know some guys here in the states have purchase insurance with http://aerialpak.com/ but if you read the fine print, you're really not covered for liability if you operate "illegally" or without the proper permits and certification...all BS if you ask me.
     
  14. Andy Johnson-Laird

    Andy Johnson-Laird Administrator
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    And Aerial Pak is not longer available for the aircraft in flight -- the gentleman with whom I spoke literally said, "And coverage ceases the moment the aircraft leaves the ground." (It should be called Ground Pak.)

    Andy.
     
  15. Howard Dapp

    Howard Dapp Active Member

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    Well that says a lot and pretty much answers any and all questions regarding the current situation here in the U.S.

    If you are a full on production company and only offer aerials as a perk you should be fine under your company's liability policy...shhhh ;)
     
  16. Andy Johnson-Laird

    Andy Johnson-Laird Administrator
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    Technically the policy you need is a General Liability with Inland Marine either as a separate policy or as a rider on the GL. I don't know anyone who's writing those policies for commercial operations of UAS -- they'll all pile into the market after when the FAA issues its regulations I'm sure, but now....?

    Speaking of which, the British Civil Aviation Authority has issued its regulations for commercial UAS operations. Seems pretty rational, considering what it might have been -- no requirements for a helicopter rating to fly an octocopter, for example. Search for the Chapter 5 page 3, table 3 -- which shows the kind of pilot certification required by UAS weight. For the Cinestar 8 with a 5D Mk III, we'd need Basic National UAS Certificate - Small aircraft (BNUC-S™ -- yeah, they've registered it as a trademark! Take that FAA!). There's a Candidate Guide that tells you about the knowledge you need and the flight test that you have to pass (see the section Flight Test on page 5).

    Let's hope the FAA goes along the same lines of reason.

    Andy.
     

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