ALTA death spiral and crash

Discussion in 'ALTA' started by Adam Varadi, Nov 26, 2015.

  1. Andreas Riem

    Andreas Riem Member

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    Globe-Flight leaves a note in every A2 they ship that you absolutely not use it with antispark.
    Did you left the antispark at your Alta when you've shipped it?
     
  2. Adam Varadi

    Adam Varadi Member

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    I've been buying everything from kopterworx, they never warned me. I trust them since they alwayse gave me good advices!
    Yes I left it on. If that ws the problem it wouldn't work for 10 flights that days, and then during flight just stopped working.
     
  3. Andreas Riem

    Andreas Riem Member

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    Not Kopterworx fault - if they didn't have heard about. And no big surprise if DJI knows about and does not tell their dealers.
    It is not clear after how many flights antisparks can be an issue - can also be that it never happens - but it is very possible that it can happen. It is like booting a pc, sometimes you have a crash and do not know why, because it works fine for years...
     
  4. Adam Varadi

    Adam Varadi Member

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    I don't really understant.
    If there is an error while booting the copter won't take of, or if it does the problem would appear very quickly.
    During flight the resistors are not in contact, so the connector work like a simple EC5 or other plug.

    I' can't see how could it cause a problem in the middle of the flight.
     
  5. Andreas Riem

    Andreas Riem Member

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    Thats the problem, this f**king failure happens due flight. It's like a crash at a pc/mac, they crash mostly while you have forgotten to store your file due working on. The resistor is not only a plug - its just in front of everything and not at the end of a line like an esc. And it reduces the power just for a short period, but maybe short enough for a booting failure. Just an idea and just knowing, that DJI has there an issue.
     
  6. Adam Varadi

    Adam Varadi Member

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    But after you plugged the connectors together the resistors are not in contact as far as I know. That means they can't have an affect during flight.
     
  7. Andreas Riem

    Andreas Riem Member

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    Its just about booting the system and the pre-power consumption of the esc. The resistor turns down the voltage for a very short time, to low-pre-load the system softly. Thats why it doesn't spark afterwards/ plugging the second battery, because the power in the system and in the battery are similar. So what happens while plugging the first battery is, that your fc and esc are "fighting" for power while booting - but the fc loses the fight against the bigger power-"magnet" esc. And with resistor there is less power to fight for, and the fc-system is the loser. Especially by DJI, because the A2-PMU is also equipped with an resistor > low power + less power = no power = booting issues.
     
  8. Adam Varadi

    Adam Varadi Member

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    In this way the fc would have an instant effect, if it's smarter then it would say that something wrong, if not after take off it would crash. No scenario would let the copter fly and in the middle of flight thr fc would just stop working.

    If the power isn't enough fot the A2 to boot up, it would simply do it when it has enough power. (This is from a friend who is an engineer)
     
  9. Mateusz Hajdziony

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    Anti sparks can be an issue if you connect them slowly... The A2's power module can't draw enough power via the resistor and throws an error (red led blinking). But you can't take off when the FC has failed to initialize. If you boot up without an issue (connect the plugs fast) then I can't really see how the anti sparks could be an issue. The rest of the plug is already in full contact (like usual bullet connector) so the resistor doesn't play any role anymore.
     
  10. Adam Varadi

    Adam Varadi Member

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    I think the same thing!
    Once I had the red blinking, did a reboot and worked fine. Asked around and nobody said the antisparks can cause crash during flight...
    But I appriciate your concern!
     
  11. Tabb Firchau

    Tabb Firchau Administrator
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    Hey Adam,

    Sorry for the delay, the ALTA team has spent quite a bit of time investigating your crash. We will get back with you shortly, again sorry for the delay, it was a complex one to investigate with the modifications done to the system (Anti Spark, Graupner telemetry system, etc)
     
  12. Adam Varadi

    Adam Varadi Member

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    Hey Tabb!

    Thanks for the info, at least now I know it's in progress.
     
  13. Andreas Riem

    Andreas Riem Member

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    We've had a issue with the A2 compass - while using antispark. It happened mid flight - afterwards no-one could tell you if it was the antispark just the compass or something different. Finally there is only the pice of advise to leave the antisparks away form your DJI A2 system. And to put it mildly - using a system to prevent a abrasion on a max 4$ sparepart and therefoer risking a up to 60K (or more) costing system... Gents, you met at the welding station changing arced plugs. ;-)
     
  14. Andreas Riem

    Andreas Riem Member

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    Tabb, please post here your conclusion - if Adam is fine with! I'm using - except antispark, a similar setup - so very interested in the result/ solution.

    @Adam, maybe the Graupner Electric Air Module is also an issue - if you believe in some older german panel threads there is the possibility to crash it when you plug plus earlier than minus or unplug the wrong direction. Therefor we're using AS150 and not EC5 or XT90 and we also ensure that the Electric Air Module is always first plugged.
     
  15. Adam Varadi

    Adam Varadi Member

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    Not only the 4usd parts, all of the components will work longer if you connect the batteries with a resistor or somehow gave the electronics some delay and not just a big shock when connecting. I see everyone using somekind of antispark who flies big copters and I know they are pros.
     
    Sam Slape likes this.
  16. Rolf Ableiter

    Rolf Ableiter Active Member

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    Adam - please(!) remove the antispark from your dji system! please!

    this was caused by an antispark:

    pass: wkm
     
  17. Adam Varadi

    Adam Varadi Member

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    Thanks for the advice. Please tell me how can you be sure that it was the antispark that caused this.
    I have followed kopterworx's advices my whole carrier, the use antisparks and strongly recommends it. I trust those guys!
    (By the way, why is the video title "stupid wkm" if the problem was caused by something else?)
     
  18. Steve Maller

    Steve Maller UAV Grief Counselor

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    I'm not sure why people insist on using antispark. Every X flights on a LiPo or a copter, you should inspect the contacts, and just replace the connector if it's pitted or otherwise damaged. Anti-spark doesn't seem that interesting, and it's quite risky.
     
  19. Ozkan Erden

    Ozkan Erden Distributor

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    Guys,

    What kind of antispark system are you talking about? Do you consider AS150 or XT90S plugs as antispark system?
     
  20. Kopterworx

    Kopterworx Distributor

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